Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

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UpwardDog
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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby UpwardDog » Thu Mar 17, 2016 8:55 am

How big are the other males in his litter?

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Amanda
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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby Amanda » Thu Mar 17, 2016 9:52 pm

One other male. He is 24.5". Remeasured Z today... 28" :eek:

Still doing the back and forth thing. She told me in her last email that she can assure me that he will not have trouble in his life and I shouldn't have anymore expenses for him due to hips. (Huh??) She also said she thinks something is being lost in translation because she doesn't feel like we are on the same page. (Obviously.) I tried to clarify and said basically ignore everything about his height and pano, bottom line is that I have a lame dog that has been lame in some measure since December that it wasn't pano related, and continues to be lame despite normal exercise. He needs extra care to get muscle tone back to support the hip. He can't hunt right now. He can't do agility maybe ever. Only difference between vet opinions is one is hopeful he will be ok eventually with lifetime supportive supplements and careful exercise, the other thinks the situation is more severe. So I have problems already and no matter what the X-rays look like, the hips come out of their sockets and two vets have confirmed hip dysplasia. So I have an unhealthy dog and I paid for a healthy one. No reply yet.

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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby whiteboxerboy » Fri Mar 18, 2016 6:19 am

Good grief, kudos to you for remaining calm & civil. I know that's the best way to deal with this but omg I'd have lost my mind by now.

What language does this lady speak? Maybe you can find someone to translate your info for her. There's no way she is this thick headed.

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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby UpwardDog » Sat Mar 19, 2016 10:21 am

How is his tail doing now? Sure hoping that issue is now resolved for good.

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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby PofiMia » Sat Mar 19, 2016 12:21 pm

He is as tall as Pofi. That is crazy! I am so sorry for your disappointment and aggravation, but glad he is feeling better.

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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby Calypso » Sun Mar 20, 2016 5:32 am

He's 3 inches taker than Cousteau and Labs are considered a large breed! I really hope she honors the difference in price between pet and show at the very least.

Just so unfair that you researched so carefully and this still happened. :-(

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Amanda
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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby Amanda » Sun Mar 20, 2016 4:04 pm

Lynn, she's Hungarian but she speaks and writes English really well. And I consider myself a coherent writer, so I am not sure why she hasn't understood my point.

Tail is almost healed. Stitches have to dissolve but he is comfortable and not bleeding anymore.

Trying to decide if we should start a solid swimming regimen and then see the specialist or if I should just bite the bullet and see the specialist right away. It's really expensive. And we want to do adequan shots too, but again, expense. Still mulling it all over.

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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby UpwardDog » Sun Mar 20, 2016 11:09 pm

If you have 2 vet opinions, why the need for the specialist right now? Would it maybe change your course of action?

In Canada vets seem to prefer Cartrophen over Adequan, so we've done Cartrophen, but it's really reasonably priced. It seemed to make a big difference for Sam, so I would lean toward doing the Adequan . If Adequan is expensive, you could ask about Cartrophen. I gave the shots myself so I wasn't paying any tech fee.

It sounds like she doesn't want to understand so she doesn't have to refund any money :hmm:

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Amanda
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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby Amanda » Sun Mar 20, 2016 11:52 pm

The rehab specialist for physical therapy. I don't know if we can get cartrophen here. It's not available in the US apparently.

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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby SherriA » Mon Mar 21, 2016 6:58 am

Apparently, according to another thread, vets can write a script for it and bring it in, or you can get it made at a compounding pharmacy. Seems to be an issue of politics/money why it's not available here.

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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby emmas_mom » Mon Mar 21, 2016 8:33 am

Cartrophen was a huge help for Eddie, as well as for several other dogs I know around here.
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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby Amanda » Mon Mar 21, 2016 1:32 pm

I'll ask my vet. Is it a huge price difference? I don't want to be a PITA for a small savings.

Here is the latest response from her. And I am hearing from multiple others now that she claims her dogs are perfect, no problems anywhere in her lines, and the people who have had problems all say she basically turns her back on them. :(

"I have sent the X-ray to a Hungarian specialist, and he said this hip is a B category, but its not perfectly positioned, but at very worst, it could be a C, which is still not the dysplasic category. He said the dog cannot be lame because of the hips!
I would also like tell, that I also have a dog, who is now so lame to one of her rear legs that all the muscle are gone from there. She is HD-A, so has excellent hip result, still she has now pain at the hip joint. We don’t yet know the reason, and because she is pregnant, we cannot properly investigate at the moment, but what I wanted to tell with this, that there can be other factors causing severe lameness (she had been lame on and off and now its quite bad, but we cannot do anything until pups are born).
If you still don’t believe that your dog is not dysplasic, than send the X-ray to OFA for evaluation! But I might ask for a 2nd X-ray in about half a year, once he gained his muscle tone back."

Interesting that her vet that hasn't seen or put hands on my dog can say the opposite of two vets that have examined him in person. I'm also alarmed that a dog with undiagnosed repetitive lameness resulting in muscle atrophy is now pregnant. I'm done. I'm no sure it's worth my time or energy to keep pushing for my refund, but bottom line is that she is not the reputable breeder I thought she was.

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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby UpwardDog » Mon Mar 21, 2016 6:43 pm

:takethat: unbelievable.

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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby Calypso » Tue Mar 22, 2016 7:46 am

My jaw dropped when I heard about the lame pregnant dog. Argh! I'm sorry. Zeke is in good hands, no thanks to her.

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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby Amanda » Thu Mar 24, 2016 9:15 pm

I decided to suck it up and see the rehab specialist. He ignores his pain when he wants to move and play, but standing still it is obvious that he doesn't put as much weight on that leg. I just want a solid game plan. I have been emailing with a woman who bought a dog from the breeder knowing he had bad hips. And through exercise and holistic support she was able to get him healthy and now his X-rays actually show good hips. I'm not sure how or why that happened but she shared her protocol with me and so I am making adjustments to our diet and lifestyle. It's little things like no jumping into the car, and adding back vitamin C to his diet. Not convinced it will all help, but it can't hurt.

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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby Amanda » Wed Mar 30, 2016 12:35 am

We went to rehab yesterday. The vet was very knowledgeable and helpful. She said that dysplastic dogs usually between 12-14 months (sometimes later for larger breeds), go through an immense growth phase that leads to severe pain in the joint. The femur clunks around and causes more arthritic changes at this time of extra bone growth. She suspects Zeke has been in this period and if we can get him stable for the next 4-6 weeks, hopefully we can get the effects of the dysplasia down to the minimum possible. So he got acupuncture yesterday and we will repeat that 3 more times. He will get 3 or 4 hydrotherapy sessions in the underwater treadmill, and two sessions of at home exercise education so that we can support him at home.

In addition, she said I don't need to change his food. She sees more effect from changing carbs than proteins (and she does TCM, so she is aware of the hot/cold proteins thing). But she didn't think we needed to limit his energy any more than he is already. He needs to move around and use his leg, so she wants him to have freedom in the house to move as he is comfortable moving. We laid down yoga mats to limit slipping for this critical period.

For supplements, we are doing glucosamine, chondroitin, MSM, hyaluronic acid, fish oil, vitamin E, and Vitamin C. I have him on a product from Costco called Move Free. The ortho vet recommended it as a cheaper alternative to dasuquin that is tested and actually has the amount of glucosamine in it that the bottle says it does. (Apparently, many supplements were tested and had far less, or in one case, nothing claimed on the label!) Rehab vet really thought the dasuquin was worth it for the ASU's. She recommended against too much fish oil and only to give the skin/coat dose until he's old and needs all the help he can get. I guess at the arthritic dose you end up inhibiting too much inflammation and leave the dog's immune system vulnerable. (Same thing can happen to humans that take lots of fish oil.) I am calling my regular vet to get a refill on Deramaxx for 3 weeks. She said this time is really critical to basically hit him with everything we have and make him as comfortable as possible. And I am also going to just get Adequan for now so that we can get it loaded into his system. If I can get Carprophen, then I will to save some money, but it's important to start asap, so we'll just do adequan.

She said he was far more lame than she expected to see after his hands on evaluation. His back muscles are very tight on the right side from hitching his step up. The acupuncture should help loosen that up and some stretching we are doing at home. He can go for flat ground, slow leash walks. No swimming as she said it makes the bone move in the joint too fast and causes too much friction for now. And that's where we are.

After all the rehab, my boss is paying for Bobbie Lyons to do a private lesson for our staff in June. I am thrilled to get to pick her brain and may even pay for a private lesson just for myself so I can hog all the attention. The rehab vet said that agility may never happen for us. She thought other less impact driven sports would be better. Hunting could happen again as long as he isn't climbing or jumping high obstacles. I am trying not to get too hung up on what we can or can't do yet. Just want to get to where he is no longer lame and we'll see what happens. We will do nosework or tracking or barn hunt or something if we can't jump and weave.

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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby Amanda » Wed Mar 30, 2016 12:39 am

Trying to add some pictures ... I don't know what order they will come in, but he made friends with the tech and wanted all of his 70 lbs in her lap. And his porcupine butt. And him all chilled out during acupuncture.

I have to give my DH credit. I discussed the cost of all this mess with him last night and he said, if you think he needs it, just do it. :love: So we are. Good thing Z is such a goofball and we like him. :rofl:
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whiteboxerboy
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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby whiteboxerboy » Wed Mar 30, 2016 5:01 am

good grief, he is so CUTE!!!

I hope this new plan is the solution and helps him feel as good as he can.

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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby SherriA » Wed Mar 30, 2016 5:53 am

Sounds like you've got a good plan and are working with someone you trust, so hooray for that!

Zeke is just too stinkin' cute :love:
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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby Sabine » Wed Mar 30, 2016 11:35 am

:love:

Hope he will overcome all these obstacles very soon! He's obviously in (many) good hands. :)
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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby emmas_mom » Thu Mar 31, 2016 5:42 pm

Okay, well that did it - I'm in love <3 <3 <3 . Why have I not seen pics of his cute fuzzy face before?
Here's hoping the new plan will pay off big time for him (and for you!).
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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby UpwardDog » Thu Mar 31, 2016 11:14 pm

Aw, I sure hope the new interventions get him feeling better quickly.

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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby Calypso » Fri Apr 01, 2016 8:38 am

Awwww! I'm glad you have a game plan. It sounds reasonable and doable. And I'm so glad your DH is on board with it!

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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby JudyL » Fri Apr 01, 2016 10:49 am

I'm happy to hear that you have a plan in place and sounds positive going forward.

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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby maxs_mommy » Fri Apr 01, 2016 8:46 pm

I hope the rehab vet can get you back on the right track so you can get back to having fun! Glad you have a plan.
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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby Amanda » Sat Apr 02, 2016 10:12 am

He now has what looked like a hot spot maybe from the adhesive from his bandages. I've been treating at home for the last four days and making him wear a cone again. The skin isn't scabbed anymore, but it is pretty swollen- more so than when I first started treating it. It's ab out two inches up from the tip, so not on the incision site. And it is squarely on top on the tail. I made an appt for Monday afternoon. Really hoping for improvement over the weekend. I do not want to go in again, but I am a little concerned about an infection from the surgery.

What is the deal with this dog!?! I practically have a pharmacy in my cabinet from just his last two months!!!

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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby Amanda » Sat Apr 02, 2016 11:11 am

Tail...
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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby Amanda » Sat Apr 02, 2016 11:16 am

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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby MaisyPancakes » Sat Apr 02, 2016 11:23 am

Yay for a plan! I am *all* for specialists for this kind of thing! I totally agree about the "good" kind of inflammation, keeping up with mobility and everything you mentioned!

Sorry about the new bump on the tail—is it painful? I'm not very familiar with hot spots, but do they poof out so much? (I thought they tend to look like open sores.) It does look very localized, though, in a neat little circle. I sure hope it just settles down and gets better over the weekend. Stop it, Zeke!

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Re: Advice please... Tail and neuter issues

Postby JudyL » Sat Apr 02, 2016 11:56 am

I don't like that it's swollen. The hair that remains is all short stubble. Did you trim that to get a better look or did Zeke chew it out? I'm wondering if he has some nerve pain from the amputation as it heals that is causing him to chew, and if he has caused that swelling and a bacterial infection on the surface of the skin.


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