Po's saga

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Re: Po's saga

Postby Calypso » Wed Jan 20, 2016 7:57 am

Oh No!!!!! So not what you expected. Fingers crossed and good thoughts sent.

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Re: Po's saga

Postby SherriA » Wed Jan 20, 2016 11:36 am

Oh no!

That said, Oliver has insanely bad liver values for the last several years of his life. We never found the cause, despite multiple tests over many months, and other than LSF, never really treated it. The numbers went up every time we did bloodwork, but that increase never seemed to correlate with any symptoms. I hope Pofi's liver numbers are just like that - weird, but no apparent harm.
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Re: Po's saga

Postby JudyL » Wed Jan 20, 2016 11:39 am

Oh no, not what we wanted to hear. I hope you get answers from the tests and find that this is very treatable.

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Re: Po's saga

Postby Sabine » Wed Jan 20, 2016 12:31 pm

Poor guy :( All fingers crossed for the best possible news.
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Re: Po's saga

Postby MaisyPancakes » Wed Jan 20, 2016 4:12 pm

Oh LM. :( I am so sorry. Like Sherri said, I, too, have heard that numbers can suck a big cucumber but it can either come down rather quickly with treatment or remain relatively asymptomatic regardless. I was wondering if you can just do U/S at first to see if biopsy is warranted, but I guess Po does not like vet visits so why not do everything at once kind of thing, too. Are you doing the U/S at the regular vet (w/traveling specialist—that's what I've done in the past) or are you going elsewhere? Tell me if you need anything; I have nothing pressing going on tomorrow. xoxoxox!!!

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Re: Po's saga

Postby PofiMia » Wed Jan 20, 2016 4:39 pm

Thanks all for sympathy and encouraging words about the numbers.

Nana, yes, he will do U/S first and only do biopsy if he thinks there is something that needs it and if he was happy with clotting numbers from tonight's blood test. But it is just our vet. Speed seemed paramount. Pofi will be under light GA again for this. No way would he lie still for all this.

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Re: Po's saga

Postby MaisyPancakes » Wed Jan 20, 2016 5:30 pm

Oh, OK. I didn't know that your regular vet did U/S. That's probably less stress for everyone. :) U/S alone can be done sans sedation (that's what MP does) but biopsy would definitely need it! I'm glad they were abel to get him in so soon. Sending you hugs!

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Re: Po's saga

Postby PofiMia » Wed Jan 20, 2016 7:07 pm

Yes, they probably could do the ultrasound without, but it would be challenging. And this way we can move right to biopsy if indicated.

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Re: Po's saga

Postby PofiMia » Wed Jan 20, 2016 7:08 pm

:smile: MP is a lot more compliant than Pofi!

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Re: Po's saga

Postby maxs_mommy » Wed Jan 20, 2016 9:22 pm

Oh crap crap crap. Keep us updated and good thoughts for the testing.
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Re: Po's saga

Postby connie » Thu Jan 21, 2016 5:08 am

Let us know when you have some results! Hoping it is something that responds to liver support and nothing further is needed.

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Re: Po's saga

Postby emmas_mom » Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:21 am

Oh no, I am soooo sorry. Keeping Po and you in my thoughts. Here's hoping it is a temporary blip or at least a correctable problem.
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Re: Po's saga

Postby UpwardDog » Thu Jan 21, 2016 10:06 am

I'm sorry to hear this. Fingers crossed the U/S is fine and the elevated liver enzymes are only from meds his been on and will come down on their own. Hang in there ((Big Hug))

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Re: Po's saga

Postby PofiMia » Thu Jan 21, 2016 10:11 am

:cool:

U/S shows nothing of note with the liver - no growths, not large or abnormal in any way. But his gallbladder is another matter! Likely gallbladder mucocele. Going with injectable abx and other drugs including liver support drug that has milk thistle, SAM-e and something else in it. The injectable abx will aid with gallbladder and his wrist lump/wound and not cause stomach upset.

I'm not celebrating gallbladder disease, but as the vet said, this is "less dire" than other possibilities!

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Re: Po's saga

Postby Calypso » Thu Jan 21, 2016 12:22 pm

Yay for "less dire"! We'll take what we can get!

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Re: Po's saga

Postby emmas_mom » Thu Jan 21, 2016 12:53 pm

Less dire is good news - not great, but certainly better than 'dire'. I had to google gallbladder mucucele - apparently can also be treated with surgery? I can't remember how old Pofi is - is surgery an option if more conservative treatment doesn't do the job?
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Re: Po's saga

Postby SherriA » Thu Jan 21, 2016 4:10 pm

I'll take less dire, for sure! Glad you at least have some answers.
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Re: Po's saga

Postby connie » Thu Jan 21, 2016 7:36 pm


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Re: Po's saga

Postby PofiMia » Fri Jan 22, 2016 5:04 am

Yes, Jean - if he does not respond to management, we will go to surgery. He is 11 though, 11.5 and had two surgeries already this last year. Not thrilled at the prospect of a major surgery for organ removal. From what I had read so far, it is recommended for dogs up to middle age - he's not middle aged!

Blood work next Thursday to see if we are having impact. And of course, we want him to be eating again, so that is another "check" to see if we want to go with the managed approach. But we could change our minds in a week to 2 weeks.

The good news is they looked at EVERYTHING inside him during ultrasound. He was very good for the procedure (sedated, but not GA) and they really spent time. Heart, abdomen, liver, pancreas, lymph nodes, etc. were reported to all look very normal. No masses anywhere, no other organs looking abnormal except gallbladder. So this can help me make a decision if management doesn't work. They said it was tough finding his kidneys because he is so deep chested, but they also looked just fine.

All in all, I THINK at this point I would really like to avoid surgery, but I'll read what Connie just posted and think more about it. It is a more certain solution.

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Re: Po's saga

Postby PofiMia » Fri Jan 22, 2016 6:02 am

Good info, Connie. The management protocol described is exactly what we are doing. The study stuff cited on management is awfully limited. Does make me pause. Especially knowing the rest of his organs look good - maybe we should consider surgery even if management seems to work. For longevity.

The sedative started wearing off middle of the night and he got up and demanded a few treats - not too much. We had started the formulated combo of SAM-e and Milk Thistle last night on empty stomach. After he had treats and a quick potty, he also wanted to go upstairs to bed (he had been sleeping downstairs and I was on the couch with him). He wanted out for a potty break at 6:15 and seemed very bright and alert and spirited. I gave him mitrazapene to make sure he would eat so I could start the Ursidiol (or whatever it is). And he ate a lot of boiled chicken for me just now with gusto and has had a few celebratory biscuits and the pill.

Appointment for next Thursday for new bloodwork and recheck, provided I keep him eating and on pill schedule. He also had an injectable abx rather than continuing with pill form to avoid stomach upset and ensure efficacy. That will last 3 weeks. Another planned in 3 weeks.

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Re: Po's saga

Postby UpwardDog » Fri Jan 22, 2016 8:36 am

I'm so glad it's not cancer or something equally awful. It's scary when they get to be seniors.Fingers crossed the non-surgical manageme nt will be a big success and he will live to be a very happy, very old dog.

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Re: Po's saga

Postby whiteboxerboy » Fri Jan 22, 2016 9:08 am

^what she said. ❤️

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Re: Po's saga

Postby JudyL » Fri Jan 22, 2016 1:03 pm

Ditto what Heather wrote. I hope the meds and supplements will solve the issue and get rid of that mucous problem. It sounds like a pretty good sign that Po was begging for treats and food so soon after starting on properly managing this. Sending good thoughts that he's heading in the right direction.

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Re: Po's saga

Postby LisaT_II » Fri Jan 22, 2016 8:42 pm

Oh my, definitely a surprise. Sure hope your plan of action I already started healing...
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Re: Po's saga

Postby PofiMia » Sat Jan 23, 2016 8:54 am

This is no easy road, I tell you. He had more boiled chicken and treats during the day, but by dinner time he only ate some boiled chicken and some more treats - beef and chicken strips. All sourced and made in US. I just need stuff in his stomach to give him the meds for the gallbladder twice daily. And for him to be getting some calories and nutrition.

He did continue to eat more jerky type treats with gusto through the night and also decided he would like a taste of the cous cous from our dinner and even some bits of steamed salmon and some of the salmon skin. Mia needed an early AM potty outing and I had the milk thistle/SAM-e combo pills in our bedroom, so used that opportunity to jam those down his throat (easier when he's sleepy!) as they absorb better on empty stomach after overnight fast. Pofi and I slept in a bit and then I gave him a Mirtazapine before I came downstairs - he came down 45 minutes later looking to eat. Really only wanted those chicken strip treats - no interest in boiled chicken even after I warmed it. But I did also open a can of beef based dog food and though he would not eat it out of a bowl, he swallowed what I put on his tongue. Probably a quarter or so of a big can. And more of those treats. So 3rd dose of the Ursodiol on deck for the gallbladder. I swear the whites of his eyes are looking whiter. Dr. T showed me they were starting to show signs of jaundice (yellowish tint) on Thursday morning before procedures.

He is acting fairly spunky. Not too awful cold today, so I will try to give them a moderate walk - baldy belly boy will have to wear his coat though!!

Thanks for all the support and continuing good thoughts!

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Re: Po's saga

Postby MaisyPancakes » Sat Jan 23, 2016 9:55 am

Aww, Pofi! I'm glad he seems to be improving, even if with resistance! I once cared for two IGs who would only eat if I hand-fed, or put the canned food directly on their (nonporous) kitchen floor. After a while of coaxing with their regular set up, I just started trying different things and that was the only way to get them to eat. Same food, same temp, etc., but just different feeding method worked for them. You could maybe try different location, too?

If he likes the jerky treats, would he'd like the boiled chicken with a little bit of seasoning, or maybe seared on a pan? I think it's great that he eats *something*, but it'd be easier for him to take in enough fluids if he'd eat wet food. :) Hang in there, LM+K!

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Re: Po's saga

Postby PofiMia » Sat Jan 23, 2016 11:04 am

Nana, I was thinking about pan searing the boiled chicken in a pan with some chicken broth to see if that increases appeal. He did just eat a heated up Oscar Meyer "Natural" turkey sausage (hot dog). And begged for bits of my bagel. We love begging.

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Re: Po's saga

Postby PofiMia » Sat Jan 23, 2016 3:40 pm

Poop report - walked the dogs and Pofi had a bm that was a bright green in the center - normal color surrounding. Honestly, looked like guacamole.... sorry. But true.

Wondering if this could be a sign he is passing that built up bile sludge?

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Re: Po's saga

Postby JudyL » Sat Jan 23, 2016 3:49 pm

Interesting, and not TMI. Is that what will happen, that the sludge will thin out and be eliminated? Could that elimination of the excess bile sludge be also causing his lack of appetite because of temporarily having too much bile released vs food intake? Maybe this is a sign that his body is adjusting back to normal.

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Re: Po's saga

Postby emmas_mom » Sat Jan 23, 2016 5:42 pm

Green poop is gallbladder issues, so I'm guessing this is a good sign - passing stuff through. I'd certainly keep an eye on it though, and mention it to the vet - if it continues for long or increases then it could indicate the gallbladder is getting worse rather than better.
As for appetite, I second what Nana said about trying different feeding methods. I forgot to mention that earlier - I often have to jump-start Mitzi with a little handfeeding, but also I have found changing the feeding dish seems to help - putting the food right on the floor, or using a small plate, using a pie plate, a small bowl, etc. Strangely, she absolutely will not eat out of her lovely little stainless dish anymore - hasn't since the worst episodes of illness. I guess she associates it with feeling sick. Changing location has sometimes helped too, but not as much as changing her dishes to something novel.
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