Anal Glands

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whiteboxerboy
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Anal Glands

Postby whiteboxerboy » Wed Dec 30, 2015 6:31 am

I'll start with "You're Welcome". I've decided against posting a picture of Pi's clean, pink bootie. :lol:

Pi's continuously draining left anal gland is finally healed. I do not have any idea what caused the infection/abscess but thank doG it's healed. It was draining blood, not stinky AG goo, but it was still very gross.

So, that's all. I was just here giggling to myself about the photo I really wanted to post but didn't.

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Re: Anal Glands

Postby Calypso » Wed Dec 30, 2015 10:36 am

LOL! I'm glad his gland is better. Also glad I didn't click on this to see shiny clean boxer butt! :)

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LisaT_II
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Re: Anal Glands

Postby LisaT_II » Wed Dec 30, 2015 11:37 am

Glad it didn't turn into a fistula, and glad there wasn't a picture - I have a collection of thoe from max!
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Re: Anal Glands

Postby SherriA » Wed Dec 30, 2015 4:08 pm

thank goodness it's healed!!
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whiteboxerboy
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Re: Anal Glands

Postby whiteboxerboy » Sat Jan 02, 2016 4:22 pm

Spoke too soon. Not healed. :frown:

How did his AG break? I really don't want him to have to have it removed.

Sadness. And some stinkiness.

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Re: Anal Glands

Postby Amanda » Sat Jan 02, 2016 6:42 pm

Boo. From what I know, once they get impacted like that they are more prone to recurrence. Hope that's not the case!

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Re: Anal Glands

Postby maxs_mommy » Sat Jan 02, 2016 7:38 pm

Talk to Emily about this. IIRC Arlo had ag rupture issues for awhile but I don't remember how she managed the situation.
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Re: Anal Glands

Postby LisaT_II » Sat Jan 02, 2016 9:56 pm

Are you using fish oil as a supplement?
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Re: Anal Glands

Postby whiteboxerboy » Sun Jan 03, 2016 8:24 am

No, I'm not giving him fish oil. He gets coconut oil, I'm only giving 1 tsp instead of his usual 2 tsp with meals.

I'm not convinced they were/are 'impacted'. Something is obviously going on but the vets have yet to say 'oh I know what this is', instead they look confused & shrug their shoulders, the same way they did with that weird infection on his back that took for-ev-er to heal & then left the bald spot.

So far he's had 10 days of zeniquen that didn't do anything & next the vet put some triple antibiotic goo directly into the troublesome sac. Not sure the goo was in there for long since it's always draining but it did clear up for a couple of days.

:blah:

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Re: Anal Glands

Postby SherriA » Sun Jan 03, 2016 9:48 am

Oh damn, I hate that he isn't healed up like you thought :(
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JudyL
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Re: Anal Glands

Postby JudyL » Sun Jan 03, 2016 10:21 am

I've had 3 dogs with an impacted AG. Two dogs' ruptured and healed without incident, and never had problems thereafter. All chihuahuas, and I made them sit in a tepid bath of Epsom's salt twice a day and kept clean otherwise. Third dog was Cinnabon and hers didn't rupture. Vet packed it with abx ointment and put on oral abx. All of the vets said that if impaction occurred more than 3-4 times, consider having the gland surgically removed. All of these were one-time incidents for each dog, so they healed up without a problem never to return.

Some dogs' glands are misshaped and don't or can't self-express by normal means when the dog eliminates, no matter how perfect the diet or how perfect and solid the poo is. The poo needs to be solid enough and large enough to push on the gland as it moves past them in the rectum and out the anus to express the contents of the gland, and that is why some products work to alleviate the problem by bulking up the stool somewhat.

The other thing that can happen is that the duct by which the contents are expelled becomes inflamed, and can actually thicken over time, so no matter the perfect firmness or bulk of the stool still can't get the AG goo out. It can become inflamed for a variety of reasons including too much or incorrect expressing, other trauma, or some other reason for the inflammation.

Some groomers think they need to express the AGs as routine, when in fact it is not necessary to routinely express the glands. They should take take of themselves unless the dog has problem glands.

How has Pi's poo been lately? Has it been really soft or runny?

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Re: Anal Glands

Postby LisaT_II » Sun Jan 03, 2016 10:46 am

Okay on the fish oil - I know a few dogs whose anal glands are really irritated by fish oil for some reason.

My experience is what judy has said...

With Jazz here, it's a combination of diet and anatomy that causes her problems, two sides, one is much worse.

With Max my fistula boy, the epsom salts did help. When it was first infected and blown (one side), the vet would pack it with abx, injecting stuff in, and that eventually healed, or so I thought - way down the road it turned into a fistula. I am now a proponent of AG removal. With the fistula - I found zinc based baby ointment the best, and alternated with a mix I used of potassium iodide into the open fistula, and the next day vit E. He was on continued abx therapy, doxycycline was the foundation of that for it's anti-inflammatory properties (he had more than one abx). Diet was insanely important, as well as no other immune suppresing things. With max, a chronic TBD was suspect.

Many GSDs are initially put on systemic abx with a bit of pred for the inflammation, for healing, because fistulas are uch a bad problem in the breed. His dermatologist aid he had another GSD that required doxy to keep the fistula in check, and that dog had a lyme background.

Just throwing alll that out there in case it sparks any ides for you.
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Re: Anal Glands

Postby whiteboxerboy » Sun Jan 03, 2016 12:00 pm

I am going to see if I can get him to sit in an Epsom salt bath - not sure how that is going to go. I think I'll have better luck with a compress, he has let me hold a warm wet paper towel on there w/o any complaining. I need to google Epsom salt compress.

History: his AG's have spontaneously expressed now & then. It happened once when he was a puppy and a couple/few other times. That's always been the end of it, though. They'd empty, I'd clean him up, the end. Typically, and I mean *every* time I was right there when he poo'ed I could see the AG juice squirt out at the end of his poo - clear, liquid drops.

His poo is typically great - not too soft, not too hard, perfectly formed & bulky enough to empty the AG's. I can't even remember now for sure but I think he had soft poo, his AG's emptied
& that started all of this. I'm going to have to add a photo - it looks so weird & maybe you guys will recognize what's going on.

Hmm, just realized I better put the picture here or nobody will see it b/c who's gonna voluntarily look at a pic of a bootie hole, even if it is pink & cute & clean.

Technical difficulties with photo upload, stay tuned.

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Re: Anal Glands

Postby maxs_mommy » Mon Jan 04, 2016 10:03 pm

How are his ears? For Max they seem to go together and one acts up at the tiniest upset from the other. If it won't stop rupturing I'd look at a bigger cause.
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Re: Anal Glands

Postby whiteboxerboy » Tue Jan 05, 2016 2:57 pm

meh, his ears are fine. i don't know what is going on with his AG's. i really don't think they're actually ruptured..... epsom salt compress seems to be helping.

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Re: Anal Glands

Postby LisaT_II » Wed Jan 06, 2016 2:45 am

Are there draining pinprick type holes?
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Re: Anal Glands

Postby whiteboxerboy » Mon Jan 11, 2016 6:11 pm

Are there draining pinprick type holes?
Hmm, I do not see any 'holes', just regular skin.
But (no pun intended, :rofl: ) after he poops & at other random times it does sort of, maybe, I guess, look vaguely like there was a piece of cheesecloth pressed against the left side of his rectum where the goo was draining. I do not mean that I can see little holes where goo is draining, I mean it seems to be oozing from that entire side rather than only from the actual hole the poo exits. Does that make sense??

It is not easy trying to describe this. I'm also doing my best to stay in denial that his AG may have actually ruptured. Veterinary surgery bills are not in my immediate financial future.

Alas, the problem persists. I am thinking I should take him to see my old vet, Dr. Fred.
L says I shouldn't have to pay for a 3rd vet visit for this at the other vet since they haven't been able to fix the problem yet but I'm not comfortable asking not to be charged AND since that vet jumped right to suggesting surgery I'm wanting a 2nd opinion anyway.

Aargh, I don't know what to do.

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Re: Anal Glands

Postby JudyL » Mon Jan 11, 2016 8:28 pm

That sounds very strange and I'd want to have someone look at him too. Iirc, Dr Fred isn't too pricey? It may be a small price to pay for your peace of mind. My vet would charge for a repeat visit whether or not they had, or had not, solved the initial problem.

Does he bother with the area or scoot? I wonder if this oozing is more of a superficial infection not involving the AG sac itself, but maybe in the skin or the oil glands around the anus. With your "cheesecloth" description, it sounds like its the skin is puffy and inflamed. Edema, maybe, kind of like cellulitis can ooze out of the pores? Could the "cheesecloth" appearance be from something he is sitting on? Your description reminds me of someone that wakes up with sheet wrinkles on the face.

Is he on any medications for infection now?

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LisaT_II
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Re: Anal Glands

Postby LisaT_II » Mon Jan 11, 2016 10:59 pm

I can say that a lot of vets do not recognize early fistulas, so I hope that isn't what is going on. Can't say much without a picture, and it sounds like it might be hard to get a picture to capture what is going on. My experience is that Max's fistula oozed first, then it would start to bubble some, before I could see little tears in the skin - "holes" open up inside, sometimes tunnels, and it takes awhile for them to break through the surface. I'm REALLY hoping that this isn't what is going on here :(
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Re: Anal Glands

Postby whiteboxerboy » Tue Jan 12, 2016 5:54 pm

Nope, no meds right now.

Nope, no scooting or licking. The only time he seems bothered by it is when it needs to be cleaned.

I looked at google images of fistulas - they all seemed to have the fistula away from the anus, as in not in the tissue right at the anus. None of the pics looked anything like what is going on with Pi.

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Re: Anal Glands

Postby whiteboxerboy » Fri Feb 05, 2016 10:07 am

Update:

Took Pi to see Dr. Fred. AG is definitely not ruptured but there is an infection. The antibiotic (for $100!!) was not the right one so no surprise it didn't help. Dr. Fred also said there's *no* reason to even think about surgery to remove the AG, it's just an infection.

Dr. Fred put Pi on Clindamycin. I'm very happy to report that I started seeing significant improvement in 24 hours and now, after 4 days the infection seems to be almost completely resolved.

Good ol' Dr. Fred. He charged me for an office visit & the clindamycin. **No** charge for the fecal exam or expressing AG's. He really makes other vets look bad, IMO. I spent $350-$400 on this at the other vet and they didn't help at all. $125 @ Dr. Fred and voila, improvement in 24 hours.

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Re: Anal Glands

Postby SherriA » Fri Feb 05, 2016 2:46 pm

Hooray for Dr. Fred!
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Re: Anal Glands

Postby connie » Fri Feb 05, 2016 3:25 pm

:love: Dr. Fred!

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JudyL
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Re: Anal Glands

Postby JudyL » Fri Feb 05, 2016 6:00 pm

That's great news! Don't ever let this man retire.

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LisaT_II
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Re: Anal Glands

Postby LisaT_II » Sat Feb 13, 2016 1:53 pm

Yay!
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Re: Anal Glands

Postby Moemer » Tue Feb 16, 2016 12:38 pm

Arlo wants to know how his Bum Bruddah is doing? I'm assuming he is done his abx?
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whiteboxerboy
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Re: Anal Glands

Postby whiteboxerboy » Tue Feb 16, 2016 1:38 pm

well thanks for checking in, Bum Bruddah!

his last dose of abx will be with dinner tonight. (i skipped a dose along the way, oops.)

he's still doing great and i reckon it's all healed up. there's no more icky draining goo or anything. and, i guess as a bonus the 'acne' on his chin healed up really quickly after starting the abx. if i don't wipe his mouth well enough after he eats he gets pimples and then he rubs his chin and they open... it's lovely. LOL
anyway, the moral to the story is Clindamycin for infected anal glands. :)

ETA: we go see dr. fred for a re-check on friday. :thumbup:


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