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#215180 - 02/19/09 08:39 AM
The Bargain Breeder
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Dog Nerd
Permanent Resident
Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 9259
Loc: Wisconsin
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Hey puppy! You are a real bargain at only $1000. Your mama might not have any big titles, but your dad is supposed to and you've got champions in your bloodlines. You're going to be the best dog. After all, I've seen your mom doing what she loves best and she's so pretty and looks so healthy. And she does her job well.
Hey puppy! Well, it's been a rough first year and all, dealing with intestinal parasites - lots of vet bills there. And then you had pano and had to be in your crate for weeks, which set your training way back. That's ok, we'll get it worked out. Unfortunately when I called the breeder who was so friendly and helpful before I got you, she was defensive and angry and we've now cut all ties. We're on our own now, puppy.
Hey puppy! Your second year hasn't been much better. The fear issues we'd hoped you would work through are still there. Instead of being the loving, social dog I thought I was getting, I have to crate you when there are new people or dogs around. You love me and a select few, but the others, especially children, scare you and you get defensive. We also found out that your breeder has now euthanized 5 puppies from several different litters for fear issues and that the stud with the champion bloodlines is no longer available for the breeder to use. (They've cut all ties with her, too.) We thought we'd have to euthanize you, too, but discovered that your "spells" are actually a series of small seizures. Between those vet bills and the bills to try to figure out what you're allergic to, it hasn't been such a great year for the budget. But the medicine helps the seizures most of the time and hopefully your fur will grow back. Right now, instead of looking regal, you're kind of goofy with your naked belly and rat tail. Now that you're neutered, instead of being my stud dog, maybe that will help.
Hey, puppy. You're five now. Your temperament issues are managed, but not resolved, despite dedicated training. Your health issues just keep piling up. We can't seem to keep weight on you - you're disinterested in food and what you do eat gets used up with your nervous energy. And now you're having problems with walking. The vet says it's either a tumor, degenerative mylopathy, or a problem with vertebrae. Exploratory or corrective surgery is out of the question because of the seizures. One way or the other, if you make it to six, it will be amazing.
Hey, puppy. What happened to the big hopes, dreams, and plans we had five years ago before you came home? Who knew that a cute little fur ball could cause so much heartache? The breeder seemed so nice, so responsible. Now we know she just told us whatever she thought we wanted to hear. No one in the breed will have anything to do with her anymore, but she keeps turning out puppies with problems just like yours. Not that she ever tells anyone that their cute puppies could turn out that way.
Hey, puppy. Let's just hope that the time we have left together has no more unpleasant surprises. It's the best we can hope for now.
------------------------------------------------------------- In honor of a friend's dog, who has lived out that story. We're waiting for a few more test results to see if we can figure out why he's going lame, but regardless, his days of flyball and agility are over. He was never temperamentally sound enough to be the Schutzhund dog he was purchased to be. Big working dog now reduced to laying around all day because that's all he can comfortably do. I thought it would be appropriate since several members on the board have been dealing with family members and co-workers who have been making uninformed choices. If his story can change just one person's mind about supporting a backyard breeder, then maybe it's worth it.
Edited by Calypso (02/19/09 05:57 PM) Edit Reason: typos
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#215182 - 02/19/09 09:14 AM
Re: The Bargain Breeder
[Re: Calypso]
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Permanent Resident
Registered: 02/03/07
Posts: 8163
Loc: CT
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Thank you so much for posting that! It broke my heart to read it. I feel so awful for your friend and her dog. Would it be OK to share it with others (particularly those co-workers and friends that are making uninformed choices)? Put this way, it sure hits home.
_________________________
Sherri & Jack & Oliver too!
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#215203 - 02/19/09 12:43 PM
Re: The Bargain Breeder
[Re: amyzon]
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Built-in Forum Feature
Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 10687
Loc: Tampa Bay, Florida
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That's so sad. 
_________________________
Paula Lilly, Jack, Alex & Will
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#215229 - 02/19/09 05:57 PM
Re: The Bargain Breeder
[Re: colliewog]
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Dog Nerd
Permanent Resident
Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 9259
Loc: Wisconsin
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#215360 - 02/21/09 05:43 AM
Re: The Bargain Breeder
[Re: Calypso]
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No, I don't have a life!
Registered: 02/28/06
Posts: 5532
Loc: New Brunswick,Canada
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Things like this happen all the time, even with the best breeders with the best reputations, and their best researched breedings. Our Newf's are prime examples of top winning show Newf's that come from well thought our breedings, they have major health issues, temperament problems. They cannot do any of the jobs a Newf should be able to do. My Sister cannot take the Newf's for long hikes, swimmming, carting etc, thank goodness she didn't pay money for her Newf's, the breeder placed the Newf's with my Sister and when they finished their show career and breeding they were signed over.
Edited by Colleen (02/21/09 06:00 AM)
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#215530 - 02/23/09 08:04 AM
Re: The Bargain Breeder
[Re: Colleen]
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Active member
Registered: 01/07/08
Posts: 383
Loc: Liberty, NC, USA
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Okay that doesn't make sense. How could the breedings have been "the best" and all that well thought out if the dogs that were placed *after being used as breeders* (egads!)had health and temperament issues to start with? I'm not picking on you, Colleen, just pointing out that show breeding doesen't necessarily equal good or well-thought-out breeding. If it did, then your and your sister's newfs wouldn't have all the problems they do and might even be able to still perform their intended purpose.
J.
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#215543 - 02/23/09 10:35 AM
Re: The Bargain Breeder
[Re: Niners]
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Yes, I do have a life!
Registered: 10/18/07
Posts: 2481
Loc: Semora, North Carolina
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Julie, I'm not Colleen, but I've been sort of looking at another little subculture of dogdom since having Jan-ette here - hunting dog breeding. The same thing, I think, comes into play. And I don't think the working Border Collie culture is innocent of this either. Breeders get caught up in lines and what looks good on paper - and it's not so much about the individual dogs and what the life (and/or working potential) of each of those puppies.  And I don't think it's that suddenly one breeder decides to breed dogs who can't ever in a million years do the dog's original function, or even normal doggy things like go for walks. I think it's generations of breeders each accepting slightly less functionality in favor of winning in the ring (or other competitions). If someone at some point says some extreme is non-functional (like wrinkles and the deformed face on a bulldog or the superhard personality of a field bred lab), fanciers will not only assert the breed has always been that way, but also that the very features that hamper its functionality actually are key to that functionality. Talking to such breeders is like dropping into BizzaroWorld. It's not just the show breeders, either, as I've said.
_________________________
Becca, Irena Farm, Semora, NC Cord, Gus, Ted, Sam, Zhi, Maggie, Lynn, Lu, Min, Tully  Waiting: Bubo and Ben http://irenafarm.blogspot.com/
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#215547 - 02/23/09 11:25 AM
Re: The Bargain Breeder
[Re: BeccaIFBC]
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Active member
Registered: 01/07/08
Posts: 383
Loc: Liberty, NC, USA
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Becca, Colleen stated that the dogs she and her sister have, in addition to not being able to do their original function (which I take to be pretty much a given with many breeds anyway and so not really up for contention) also have major health issues and temperament problems and it was to that statement that my comments were directed. I don't think you can say a breeding was well-thought-out or "good" if the breeder(s) consistently produces dogs with health and temperament problems--I don't care what venue the breeder is breeding for (show, pet, work, nothing in particular). What struck me about Colleen's comments was that she said the dogs had health and temperament problems and were placed with her sister after being used for show and breeding. That is a huge disconnect to me and at least in my world doesn't constitute a well-researched and well-thought-out breeding. Maybe they were just looking at the pedigree papers and not the individual dogs, but if the dog in front of you has health and temperament problems, you should think long and hard about breeding it, no matter what it's to be used for. Just my opinion of course.
J.
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#215549 - 02/23/09 11:52 AM
Re: The Bargain Breeder
[Re: Niners]
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Yes, I do have a life!
Registered: 10/18/07
Posts: 2481
Loc: Semora, North Carolina
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I'm not defending it. I'm saying how this sort of thing can happen - how the mindset can be, "This is a good breeding" even though there are health and temperament issues. Consider the breeds which basically have to choose among the lesser of two evils in terms of health - where the individuals who carry no health problems at all, represent a tiny percentage of the breed. Or where "good breeding" - top winning dogs - by default DO have what we would consider to be debilitating problems - like the Pekinese who have to sit on cooling packs on the table because a walk around the ring overheats them so badly. Pugs with incontinence problems from breeding for that tight curly tail. The list goes on and on. Working breeders can get kennel blind in the tempermental department. If the dog wins and doesn't kill its kennel mates outright, then we can overlook the fact that it takes tight management to keep the dog's foul temper under control. Of course I'm totally of your opinion. I think the whole package needs to be considered. Not just "enough to win" or even "enough to get the job done" but considering how those weaknesses can affect the next generation, or play out over time. I have said before that there's several deal breakers in my book, that I know aren't for other breeders, in terms of soundness. It's a pretty widespread issue though. It starts at the "top" and filters down to result in "Hey Puppy." 
_________________________
Becca, Irena Farm, Semora, NC Cord, Gus, Ted, Sam, Zhi, Maggie, Lynn, Lu, Min, Tully  Waiting: Bubo and Ben http://irenafarm.blogspot.com/
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#215798 - 02/25/09 07:27 PM
Re: The Bargain Breeder
[Re: Colleen]
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Dog Nerd
Permanent Resident
Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 9259
Loc: Wisconsin
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Well, the diagnosis is in and it's not good.  The vet thinks he has a lumbosacrel disease, possibly cauda equina (I haven't heard of it so I don't know much). He also has arthritic end plates in his back. He's only 5 for crying out loud! Further diagnosis and treatment would range in the thousands of dollars and involve many new vets and vet offices. For a dog who isn't mentally stable to begin with and the treatment buying only months and not curing the condition, the best my friend can do is to keep him comfortable until she can't anymore.  The thing that really makes me angry, in addition to the pain and suffer of this dog and my friend, is the other puppies in the litter. I think there were at least 7 puppies in this litter. While it's possible this boy is a genetic freak, it's not super likely. What are the chances that the other dogs are owned by someone as conscientious as my friend in caring for him?
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#215799 - 02/25/09 07:29 PM
Re: The Bargain Breeder
[Re: Calypso]
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Permanent Resident
Registered: 02/03/07
Posts: 8163
Loc: CT
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How sad  I'm sorry for your friend, and for her dog. I hope she can keep him comfortable.
_________________________
Sherri & Jack & Oliver too!
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